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China poised to lead U.S. in clean energy

New York Times -- Over the past decade, whenever I went to China and engaged Chinese on their pollution and energy problems, inevitably some young Chinese would say: “Hey, you Americans got to grow dirty for 150 years, using cheap coal and oil. Now it is our turn.”
It’s a hard argument to refute. Eventually, I decided that the only way to respond was with some variation of the following: “You’re right. It’s your turn. Grow as dirty as you want. Take your time. Because I think America just needs five years to invent all the clean-power technologies you Chinese are going to need as you choke to death on pollution. Then we’re going to come over here and sell them all to you, and we are going to clean your clock — how do you say ‘clean your clock’ in Chinese? — in the next great global industry: clean power t

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Submitted Jul 05, 2009 By: RoadKing95

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Mowerman08 All-Star Author Milwaukee Posts:959 Points:429,700 Joined:Aug 2008	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 6:10:32 PM Ignore Mowerman08 Report Abuse I'll believe it when I see it!
coreymore1 Champion Author Texas Posts:9,894 Points:1,179,135 Joined:Sep 2005	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 6:04:09 PM Ignore coreymore1 Report Abuse We need to lead
OTISFL All-Star Author Pensacola Posts:828 Points:148,380 Joined:Apr 2009	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 6:04:08 PM Ignore OTISFL Report Abuse I fully agree, we are on the downslide in every area---doom & gloom.
coreymore1 Champion Author Texas Posts:9,894 Points:1,179,135 Joined:Sep 2005	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 6:02:56 PM Ignore coreymore1 Report Abuse Go US
CISA Champion Author Orange County Posts:2,089 Points:673,320 Joined:Dec 2006	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 6:01:34 PM Ignore CISA Report Abuse RoadKing95-- pls post that are free to read, not like the NYT access.
pliskin Champion Author Syracuse Posts:3,190 Points:974,425 Joined:Apr 2005	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 5:57:30 PM Ignore pliskin Report Abuse We're falling behind in just about every area.
CoffeeTrader Champion Author Victoria Posts:2,412 Points:443,680 Joined:Sep 2008	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 5:53:50 PM Ignore CoffeeTrader Report Abuse China needs to get on board with the rest of the world and cleanup their act.
DellDude2 Champion Author Nashville Posts:3,974 Points:1,147,710 Joined:Aug 2005	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 5:53:26 PM Ignore DellDude2 Report Abuse Is Al Gore busy moonlighting at the NYTimes under a nom de plume? As Clint would say "...he's a legend... in his own mind."
purplebears Champion Author Milwaukee Posts:3,006 Points:452,200 Joined:May 2009	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 5:52:30 PM Ignore purplebears Report Abuse "China???? They are intent on taking over the world, and we have leftists here who are willing to let them!!!" Sorry brus282, but who do you think owns the US? China is the payee of most of the debt the US has. If our military had to engage the Chinese, do you think we'd win? LOL!!! There is over 2 billion of them and only 300 Million of us. Who would we borrow from to pay for any military action? They certainly won't loan us an money to fight them.
miamimusic Champion Author Miami Posts:1,477 Points:507,080 Joined:Oct 2008	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 5:48:22 PM Ignore miamimusic Report Abuse This makes a lot of sense.
star_deceiver Champion Author British Columbia Posts:3,001 Points:700,650 Joined:Jun 2008	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 5:46:09 PM Ignore star_deceiver Report Abuse That's cause the US in getting further and further behind the times!
ChEPhD Champion Author Pittsburgh Posts:1,050 Points:212,470 Joined:Feb 2009	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 5:41:44 PM Ignore ChEPhD Report Abuse it probably won't work
billsandi Champion Author Lexington Posts:7,572 Points:1,408,225 Joined:Aug 2005	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 5:35:14 PM Ignore billsandi Report Abuse China is a long way from being "poised to lead US in clean energy" IMHO.
tomok Champion Author Portland Posts:18,269 Points:1,363,135 Joined:Aug 2006	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 5:32:00 PM Ignore tomok Report Abuse Renewable energy from solar, wind, thermal, tidal, hydro, or nuclear for the electric vehicle. Solar cells and/or wind turbines mounted on your house and run that electric meter backwards. Charging the electric vehicle for free or generate a small income from the local utility. Support the electrical grid! Alternative fuels from NON food sources and CNG. No subsidies for fuel made from food.
johnwinger Champion Author Twin Cities Posts:5,347 Points:1,211,170 Joined:Oct 2001	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 5:31:22 PM Ignore johnwinger Report Abuse "Poised" is not the same as doing it.
brus282 Champion Author North Carolina Posts:4,626 Points:943,225 Joined:Aug 2007	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 5:29:34 PM Ignore brus282 Report Abuse China???? They are intent on taking over the world, and we have leftists here who are willing to let them!!!
caddilac Champion Author Ontario Posts:10,642 Points:1,158,080 Joined:Apr 2007	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 5:27:04 PM Ignore caddilac Report Abuse Step by step other countries are getting ahead of the U.S. in technology, mainly because the 'Average Joe' in the U.S. seems to fight tooth and nail against those technologies. Mention hydrogen, and someone that hasn't read about the Hindenburg will say that hydrogen is a bomb and will blow up like it did in the Hindenburg. That same argument of 'it's a bomb and will blow up' was used when gasoline was first used in cars and trucks. They won't bother to educate themselves and find out that it was the 'iron oxide/aluminum' coating that was burning with such high intensity seen in those old movies of the Hindenburg burning. The hydrogen had already escaped through the holes in the burst bladder, much like air will blow out of a burst balloon. Mention wind, and there will be those uneducated people saying that the technology hasn't been perfected yet. They too haven't kept abreast of the technology. Mention solar, and there will be those that will tell you that solar cells aren't developed far enough yet. Those people too haven't taken the time to educate themselves and keep up on the advancements made in solar cells in just the last few years. They are content to stay ignorant and pass along outdated misinformation.
ramboTX Champion Author Dallas Posts:4,273 Points:832,490 Joined:Aug 2007	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 5:25:23 PM Ignore ramboTX Report Abuse Well they have our wealth now. So they can afford it. They are becoming "THE" world power. Our CEO"S gave it to them.
subnuke Champion Author Atlanta Posts:2,783 Points:562,825 Joined:Sep 2008	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 5:25:03 PM Ignore subnuke Report Abuse The chinese do not even use CO2 scrubbers on their coal plants - thay are a long way from "clean energy."
GOLDWING2003 Champion Author California Posts:1,713 Points:421,310 Joined:Jun 2008	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 5:13:23 PM Ignore GOLDWING2003 Report Abuse This article reminded me of an old saying, "What goes around, comes around." In this case, just don't go swimming with the alligators. But if you do go in to swim, please watch your behind.
jjjleblanc Champion Author Rochester Posts:2,188 Points:620,740 Joined:Jun 2008	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 5:13:07 PM Ignore jjjleblanc Report Abuse They'll buy the knock offs from Thailand.
nozzle46 Champion Author Little Rock Posts:2,463 Points:623,230 Joined:Jul 2006	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 5:11:47 PM Ignore nozzle46 Report Abuse We'll just have to see, won't we?
DancingDee Champion Author Gary Posts:2,631 Points:681,180 Joined:Jul 2005	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 5:10:51 PM Ignore DancingDee Report Abuse That's a switch!
SFL1 Champion Author Albany Posts:9,208 Points:1,735,955 Joined:Sep 2005	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 5:07:00 PM Ignore SFL1 Report Abuse The True Fact Is, Almost every nation who exist on this planet called Earth will have cleaner energy than The United States of America, WHY ??? it's called Nuclear Energy. Somehow the Old Story of the Tortouis and the Hare comes to mind. How Long will America sleep on the sidelines, while these other countries continue foreword and gain strength and Superiority over America ? America hade better wake up before it's too late !
hoosierdaddyno1 All-Star Author Indiana Posts:937 Points:469,615 Joined:Oct 2008	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 5:03:09 PM Ignore hoosierdaddyno1 Report Abuse Talk ,Talk they have major issues with the environment. They are selling out to get our manufacturing jobs but don't have to play by the same rules!
rgjoslin Champion Author Colorado Springs Posts:3,475 Points:657,380 Joined:Sep 2008	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 5:01:46 PM Ignore rgjoslin Report Abuse Someday soon they will own us..
netman044 Champion Author Texas Posts:3,844 Points:646,060 Joined:Sep 2005	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:59:37 PM Ignore netman044 Report Abuse While watching the Olympics last summer I wondered how the residents of Beijing could breathe at all. It really looked worse than the L.A. basin with no wind.
TopGunn Champion Author Baltimore Posts:4,224 Points:1,636,735 Joined:Aug 2004	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:58:57 PM Ignore TopGunn Report Abuse We used to be a wo4rld leader. Seems we are now trying to be a follower (except for bailouts and spending money we don't have).
Focus2 Champion Author Illinois Posts:3,999 Points:1,210,780 Joined:Mar 2006	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:57:40 PM Ignore Focus2 Report Abuse You can't seem to get everyone on board with clean energy. Right now the GOP and some Democrats paid off by lobbyist with $1500 breakfast meetings are fighting the change tooth and nail and want to keep things as they are. We once were a leader but even that seems to have vanished.
saveongasNC Champion Author North Carolina Posts:3,287 Points:721,000 Joined:Aug 2008	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:50:52 PM Ignore saveongasNC Report Abuse Well said ach.
the_peddler Champion Author Detroit Posts:1,303 Points:349,150 Joined:Sep 2008	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:47:42 PM Ignore the_peddler Report Abuse as the old saying goes " don't count your chickens before they hatch " We need to work on cleaning up here. if others decide to follow us, thats great!
MikLamb Champion Author Texas Posts:3,038 Points:1,197,190 Joined:Jun 2006	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:44:01 PM Ignore MikLamb Report Abuse Who cares who invents what? Let's just ALL use clean energy!
LeeFree Champion Author Pittsburgh Posts:4,370 Points:1,289,675 Joined:Jun 2005	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:43:11 PM Ignore LeeFree Report Abuse The US will invent it and China will copy and produce it much cheaper.
dkinsf Champion Author San Jose Posts:2,367 Points:669,085 Joined:Mar 2007	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:43:09 PM Ignore dkinsf Report Abuse The biggest advantage going that the Chinese have over the rest of the world is that the use punitive means to persuade their people. We try to coax our folks with incentives. This will mean that China will be living the green life long before we will have any significant improvement.
FlashMO Rookie Author St. Louis Posts:3 Points:385 Joined:Jul 2009	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:40:22 PM Ignore FlashMO Report Abuse The Chinese have been trying to kill us for years! Let them kill a few of their off for a change!
PaulieFresh Rookie Author Toledo Posts:36 Points:239,495 Joined:Mar 2008	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:39:17 PM Ignore PaulieFresh Report Abuse Take THAT China!
DrCashFlow Champion Author Massachusetts Posts:2,430 Points:691,395 Joined:Jun 2008	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:38:19 PM Ignore DrCashFlow Report Abuse just another example of usa becoming the avis of the world, but without trying harder.
TBONE3 Champion Author Pennsylvania Posts:3,870 Points:1,000,670 Joined:Mar 2005	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:37:13 PM Ignore TBONE3 Report Abuse So, let 'em!
trojanskip All-Star Author Orange County Posts:636 Points:347,480 Joined:Mar 2008	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:31:23 PM Ignore trojanskip Report Abuse big mouth..
ach All-Star Author Illinois Posts:654 Points:331,125 Joined:Jun 2008	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:30:05 PM Ignore ach Report Abuse As we say out here in the sticks, "New York Times = Hog Wash".
BigBobOH Sophomore Author Cleveland Posts:217 Points:102,710 Joined:Mar 2009	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:28:03 PM Ignore BigBobOH Report Abuse Lets not spend all day worrying whats going on on the otherhalf of the world... We need to become a little selfcentered and take care of our contry!!!!
RoadKing95 Champion Author San Jose Posts:15,147 Points:2,621,840 Joined:May 2003	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:27:46 PM Ignore RoadKing95 Report Abuse aarrrt is spot on. You don't have to believe in global climate change. You can't ignore however that we need to get back in the lead on the next big market. We all can write our congresspeople and the president to get them to get us going on nuclear. It is just another example of how we invented, and then let the rest of the world profit from it. France and Japan get most of their energy from nuclear, and they got the technology from us. Let's do something about it instead of complaining about what one party or the other has done to us.
DarthDadJr Champion Author Virginia Posts:3,318 Points:641,635 Joined:Jul 2008	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:23:24 PM Ignore DarthDadJr Report Abuse The Chinese are fast learners...it won't take them long to catch up.
e3p0 Champion Author Columbus Posts:2,179 Points:583,090 Joined:Mar 2006	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:23:03 PM Ignore e3p0 Report Abuse Talk is cheap, I want to see the results first.
Rajah Champion Author Illinois Posts:4,682 Points:1,507,790 Joined:Jul 2005	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:21:10 PM Ignore Rajah Report Abuse They're hardly a shining example when it comes to pollution control to this point, but they'll copy our techniques and, if they're patented, ignore that little detail.
moonrocks Champion Author San Diego Posts:1,345 Points:667,020 Joined:May 2008	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:21:02 PM Ignore moonrocks Report Abuse BlueVanGroup. Your post was spot on.
BlueVanGroup Champion Author Colorado Posts:2,238 Points:571,435 Joined:May 2008	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:17:00 PM Ignore BlueVanGroup Report Abuse China has some advantages in this area: if environmentalists try to block solar or wind installations in the desert, China will just shoot them. Also, China isn't masochistic enough to cripple its economy with cap-and-trade schemes.
georgeo Champion Author California Posts:2,491 Points:101,385 Joined:May 2009	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:16:55 PM Ignore georgeo Report Abuse The real news will be when China accomplishes this.
BillHeatherL Champion Author Alberta Posts:2,751 Points:978,135 Joined:Apr 2007	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:15:59 PM Ignore BillHeatherL Report Abuse N. America has a long way to go to get clean
PDQBlues Champion Author San Diego Posts:2,269 Points:500,375 Joined:Jan 2009	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:12:31 PM Ignore PDQBlues Report Abuse Good news! China is one of the biggest polluters in the world. Their citizens are dying from it. If they can develop clean energy, we can, and hopefully we can work together to come up with great ideas.
Daphne2001 Rookie Author Virginia Posts:11 Points:1,955 Joined:Jul 2009	Message Posted: Jul 5, 2009 4:12:31 PM Ignore Daphne2001 Report Abuse That's not a good argument for the Chinese to say that we got 150 years of polluting and now it is there turn. America for the most part did not understand what the polluting was doing and did not have alternative energy available at that time. We do not live independently when it comes to world polluting. They can benefit from our experience and have benefited from the products and technology that we experienced our that time.